This guy is supposedly a head honcho or something. And he actually says that Ron Paul has a "good chance" of winning in September. My god...even the supposedly INTELLIGENT Ron Paulians are idiots.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=132848
Drsteveparent
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Originally Posted by The Good Doctor
So in light of what has happened in MN, Alaska, and Washington (not sure where else) is anyone keeping track of how this may affect the total number of delegates McCain will be getting?If this is happening in all states, can this prevent McCain from getting the nomination? And how will this affect the convention? Will it be brokered?
Sorry, but I think this is new ground we may be treading here concerning the process. Although I am still trying to learn.
If things continue as they are we have a very good shot and winning in September.
I have most of the numbers of our actual delegates for these meetup groups that have been involved have been sending them to me after every convention however i am not going to make that information public at this time. What i will say is that the reports in the media do not even come close to how many delegates we actually have. I will let you know more soon but yes if we keep this up we have a good chance at forcing a brokered convention and i said we just need to have a few key states unbind thier delegates and we can win this thing in September.
Dr. Steve Parent
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Did no one inform these people that Ron Paul dropped out as a candidate weeks ago?
Dave
No he didn't, Dave. He is still campaigning and has not dropped out of the race.
"the campaign is winding down" only means that the majority of the states have decided, and the race in those states is over.
"we may not win in the conventional sense" only means that winning is a matter of perception, and if people wake up and realize that the neocons have stolen the Republican party, then there is still hope for the future.
This is far more about the Message of Liberty and Freedom than it is about the Messenger, Ron Paul.
For people that are career politicians it is hard for them to understand why someone would stay in the race when they have "presumptively" lost. But there is more to this campaign than winning the presidency. It has always been about trying to wake up America to the fact that our Government has been stripping us of our civil liberties in the name of "security" and has been destroying the economy through a corrupt banking, spending, monetary, and foreign policy. These other candidates represent EVERYTHING that is wrong with America and has been wrong with it for nearly 100 years.
Ron Paul never really wanted the presidency for personal gain (as most men do). He ran because if he didn't run and stand up for the Constitution and the People, no one else would.
Many supporters start talking about the possibility of still getting the nomination. This comes from the fact that the numbers the Main Stream Media reports are mere estimates. They don't have the time, understanding, or maybe even the "agenda" to explain to the people how the delegate process really works.
We can get into a whole other topic about how NBC, ABC, CBS, ESPN, History Channel, A&E, HBO, Fox News, and virtually every major news publication are owned by International companies that have massive influence in Government and profit from its policies. Some companies like General Electric that owns NBC makes billions of dollars in Government contracts. These companies control the media coverage of the candidates, the debates and the questions asked, the interviews, and the positive or negative spin that everyone in the world sees.
So when Ron Paul supporters who realize this is happening look at the presumptive delegate counts that the MSM is reporting, they think to themselves "screw you, I don't want to be TOLD who my next President will be. We'll show you what the numbers REALLY are."
Most people don't mind losing per se if it was fair. But it has NEVER been fair and unbiased. Then they are criticized for trying to use their own rules (to the letter) against the same Establishment that oppresses them.
But even if the MSM was more impartial, it looks a little strange to have news coverage of a Primary then tell the people that it means NOTHING and the delegates for that state may be decided weeks or even months later, and may not even reflect how the votes were cast. People have a 2 second attention span and don't want to hear that their vote is really just a beauty contest but the DELEGATES really select the nominee. This process isn't new, it has been this way for decades. Only, no organized group of citizens have ever really stood up to this authoritarian Establishment until now.
Will McCain likely win the nomination... of course. Have you ever seen the movie "Dumb and Dumber"? There is a famous line by Jim Carey (Lloyd).
Lloyd: What are the chances of a guy like you and a girl like me... ending up together?
Mary: Well, that's pretty difficult to say.
Lloyd: Hit me with it! I've come a long way to see you, Mary. The least you can do is level with me. What are my chances?
Mary: Not good.
Lloyd: You mean, not good like one out of a hundred?
Mary: I'd say more like one out of a million.
[pause]
Lloyd: So you're telling me there's a chance.
Ron Paul isn't "mathematically" out of it as long as national delegates are still being chosen and the votes are cast at the National Convention. Bound or unbound, you never know how people will actually vote. For many supporters, if there is ANY chance; any light, that is enough to keep fighting. No one can ever say we aren't devoted to the cause of Freedom and Liberty.
But there is more to it than that. Most of these supporters (the Grassroots Movement) are really working independently from Ron Paul. They aren't taking orders from him, and in fact he isn't giving any. They are doing this on their own. He is simply trying to spread the message of Freedom and TRUE Conservative Republican values.
Neo-Cons have taken over the party and many people see the delegate process as a means to take their party back. What the Republican party is today really isn't "Republican" at all. And THAT is the message they are trying to get across. There is the party "platform" to consider. There is also the issue of gaining certain seats and gaining influence to assist the "cause" in future elections. These are all worthy goals as the Neo-Cons did the same thing to take the party away from the Republicans in the first place.
That is why you see so many Ron Paul supporters all over the place. The message of Freedom brings out people from all walks of life. They don't all agree with each other as to the direction they should be taking. In fact, not all of them (including myself) even agree with Ron Paul on EVERYTHING. But it is a step in the right direction. If you don't want a socialist state or a police state, there is no other alternative than Ron Paul.
I'm just tired of our elected officials doing whatever the hell they want and destroying the laws that have served as the foundation of our Country's entire existence. If we no longer follow the Constitution, there is little else left and there is no such thing as Freedom.
OK...so he didn't drop out..but that doesn't make StevePArents comment any less ridiculous.
Ron Paul does not WANT his supporters doing this. He has made it pretty clear that he does not. Because he knows that it will destroy his future political career, and the "cause". He will not win, and the GOP will simply change the rules to not allow you children to try to disenfranchise millions of voters again.
Did you ever think that maybe the man doesn't WANT to be starting a presidency at age 73?
livertyordeath...Ron Paul's chances of getting the nomination are far worse than Lloyd's chances of dating Mary Swanson.
They are zero. Even if John McCain dropped out, Ron Paul would not be the nominee.
[No To RonPaulians] - his chances are not zero. It is impossible to know what will happen for certain, but I agree that it isn't good. In fact, even unlikely. I also agree that even if McCain dropped out, they would still try to make someone else (who totes the party line) the nominee.
But ASIDE from the nomination, the fact that the GOP would wield this type of power to insure their own political agenda makes this process that much MORE worthwhile.
I think these disenfranchised Conservatives are fed up with their Country, their Media, and their party being completely controlled for the benefit of the elite few. This country no longer represents the People, and our "representatives" don't represent the People either.
Often times they must be corrupt to get into office which insures that they will also be corrupt once they are there. The entire system is broken.
There is such a vast influence on public opinion based on misinformation that the ONLY way to fight back is to try to take back the very instrument that causes this malicious perversion of our Constitution.
Against that type of tyranny these supporters have every right to participate in the process and challenge the same establishment that stole the Party from them in the first place.
Forget about Ron Paul getting the nomination. Even if the chance is remote, there is more to accomplish than that.
You do bring up an interesting point as to what Ron Paul's true intentions are. It is hard to know for sure since there is seemingly a deliberate break between the campaign and the Grassroots organization.
There is no doubt that Ron Paul believes in Freedom, civil liberties and sound money. But an argument can be made that some of his supporters want this presidency more than he does. Members of his campaign staff have even said that because his time was so limited (being an active Congressman) he wasn't able to campaign or fund raise as much as some of the other candidates. Then there is the topic of him taking a "break" in the middle of the campaign to secure his re-election to Congress. If his primary goal was to start a Movement and begin to wake up America to these issues, he has succeeded. But if the Movement's goal (independent of Ron Paul) is to take this knowledge and DO SOMETHING, then I'd say they are doing a pretty good job. Clearly it is making a lot of the Party leadership very nervous. And they should be.
In the short term, who knows how much the Movement will really be able to accomplish at the National level, but supporters have already proven to have many successes at the local, county and even state levels. It's a start.
Though some Ron Paul supporters are much more zealous and extreme, I think the vast majority are just rational people that want REAL change (not just the talk of change with no real ideas to back them up).
We want our Freedom back. We want our Country back. We are tired of being taxed for policies we don't agree with or projects we don't want. We are tired of this Fascist Government being controlled by the Bankers or the large corporations. We are tired of the Government taking control of our lives and FORCING us to play along as if everyone who rightfully questions their authority to do so is a terrorist. But this is exactly what they think. What better way to take out the opposition and maintain power than to first get everyone afraid of terrorists, thereby justifying the civil rights violations, but then relabeling what a "terrorist" is. (SEE Patriot Act 2 and the Homegrown Terrorist Act)
It is hard for any freedom-loving American to just sit and "take it". If any American really believes in the founding principles of the Constitution, then we MUST fight for them, even against our own Government. The founding fathers told us this might happen and what to do if it did.
The Constitution was created to protect the rights of all Americans and limit the potential abuse of power. Unfortunately those limits have slowly been eroded through deception and manipulation.
The problem is that many Ron Paul supporters have taken it too far. Either they are SOOO angry at the injustice of it all that they can't think rationally or it becomes so hard to differentiate between friend and foe that they assume EVERYONE else is the enemy. I believe that most people are good and honest and have either been misinformed or haven't realized the jeopardy that their freedom is in. They are so used to things being bad and living in fear and being overtaxed that they don't realize that it actually isn't the rightful role of Government to do so.
LoL, keep watching your boob tube and go back to sleep..
No, iberty..it is zero. Sure...you can say that technically it is not. In the same way that you can say that on a molecular level, when you place a can of saod on a table, the can is not actually TOUCHING the table. There are always some molecules in between.
But for someone living in the REAL world, which you clearly are not, and for someone who contributes to society (which you clearly do not) and someone who is not an embarrssment to his parents (which you clearly are) Ron Paul has ZERO chance.
Technicallyspeakijng, you can say that YOU have a chance of being president. And you'd be right. You have about the same chance as Ron Paul. Unless you aren't 35. In that case, I have as good a chance as Ron Paul.
[No To RonPaulians] - No need to be hostile, I wasn't attacking you. You actually bring up some decent points and I was trying to explain how many different types of Freedom supporters there are and what their mindset is.
It is really irrelevant if he has a chance or not. As I have been saying in my posts that you may have accidentally skipped over, there is much more at stake here than whether or not Ron Paul gets a nomination.
Yes, there are some Ron Paul supporters that will swear with their dying breath that he WILL win. That kind of irrational thinking by supporters of the Movement is unfortunate, especially when Ron Paul himself is more realistic than some of these people are. But you can't stop those people. There are people like that in every campaign and often the blind optimism of a nomination is more to help keep the Movement going and shake up the GOP than anything else.
Anyway, I'm not trying to convert you. Just trying to shed some light on the various types of people I've come across over the last year. Those that are really in this for the long haul and are just trying to restore Freedom and civil liberties to all Americans have different motives for trying to take back the GOP that was taken from them to begin with. It really has very little to do with Ron Paul getting a nomination.
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